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Terrible knock on newly swapped SR

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WakingDream

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Discussion starter · #1 · (Edited)
WakingDream's SR rebuild / swap

Hey guys. Bought a redtop from JDM Engine Zone 2 days before thanksgiving. FINALLY got it started. At first i had a problem with it idling at 3k rpms but i was told to let it sit for around 10 seconds and the computer should "relearn" its correct idle which did infact work. BUT while i was fixing the idle whenever i would shut the car off it would make a bad knocking sound. The car has only been started now a handful of times since the swap and now the motor when idling sounds TERRIBLE. Is it possible my CAS isnt adjusted correctly and making the motor knock? I am going to run a compression test in 2 days to see if something is blown on the bottom end. ANY info or insight would be a life saver as the car is my daily driver and the motor blew up so i replaced it with the sr which ive been working on for over a month now. Ive dropped over $3k on motor and slight mods and its looking like the motor is nothing more than a paperweight.
 
#2 ·
Hate to break it to you but if it's really "knocking" you need bearings. Get someone else who know that sound listen to it. Also the timing chain can tap on the top guide under the valve cover making a pretty horrific sound.

Did you check the oil pan for dents before installing and do you have an oil pressure guage?
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
FIRST you are from MD so two thumbs up. Im from the germantown / gaithersburg / rockville area ^^. anyways, it doesnt sound like the timing chain, id alwmost swear its the bottom end..... my dad seems to think its NOT blown considering it wasnt doing all this knocking a week ago before the intercooler piping was hooked up... seems to think its running very lean which is super bad on turbo motors, i know. is it necissary to upgrade fuel pumps when going from ka to sr? and would the CAS make the car run to where it knocked? and, no i have no oil pressure gauge atm. and yea actually the oil pan has been scrapped and scuffed all to hell... the middle of it is dented in...
 
#4 ·
Typically, people get upgraded fuel pumps, but it's not necesary. Do you have a upgraded FPR? Could be that your current FPR is starving the engine. On another note, a dented oil-pan can cause a pressure difference in the oil, but I really doubt that thats your problem IMO.
 
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Discussion starter · #5 · (Edited by Moderator)
nope stock fpr... only upgrades are cx racing intercooler piping, cold air with maf on it, megan racing 02 turbo dump pipe and i think thats it... nothing major at all.... i know a good bit about motors and so do the people im working with, but this is my first real engine swap of any sort.... this whole taking over a month and a half to get the damn thing running is driving me insane

oh and freddy intake manifold
 
#6 ·
Hey cool ive only been in md like 6 months i like it though.

Pull the oil pan asap and check it out. The SR oil pickup is super close to the bottom it could be starving the engine for oil. Only knocking I ever heard from an engine at idle is a rod knocking. Not trying to be negative but it sounds like the symptoms. You will know for sure when you pull the oli pan off. Look for metal shavings.
 
Discussion starter · #7 · (Edited by Moderator)
hmmm ok, im kinda new to sr20's and actually new to swapping motors and such haha ive owned an srt-4 , 3000gt vr-4 and an 03 evo with exhaust, cam, re-tune and 26psi.... im a driver type, not mechanic so im still learning alot haha im just praying it a spun bearing, not a broken rod...

btw what would you recommend for checking my oil pressure? do i HAVE to buy a guage? im pretty tapped out from xmas and all the money spent on this swap.... cuz im thinking my oil pump may be dead, but i was told the motor has less than 70k miles on it so it shouldnt be worn out already..... guess i just really need to pull off the oil pan
 
#8 ·
No you don't have to I would deff install one later if I were you. If you had one when you first cranked it though you would immediately know if there is a problem. Yeah bent oil pan is a common problem with sr's that get shipped. Many people have spun a bearing like that. I hope you don't find anything bad in the pan. I seriously doubt you have a bad oil pump, not a common failure. They usually get gradually weaker or clogged with crap from a blown motor
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
hmmm so you think the oil isnt being picked up due to the oil pan being bent? also i forgot to mention, i have regular gas in the car from my old KA. its almost empty though. And the gas has been sitting in the tank for like 8 months now through really hot and really cold weather now. Think shitty gas would make it knock? and could i just put like half a tank of premium in it to dilute the rest of the regular in the tank? and btw, thanks for your fast response and your help :10:
 
Discussion starter · #11 · (Edited by Moderator)
yea... it was idling high, at 3k rpms at first and then i guess the ecu relearned the idle and dropped it to under 1k and under 1k rpms the knock sounded quite loud.... im thinking it may not be getting any oil due to the pan being bent in pretty bad and im just hoping it didnt spin a bearing or something.... dont feel like having to get my crank turned

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sorry for them being huge but they are already uploaded =/ just some random pics of my car / motor
 
#12 ·
:fonix:
As much as you say you know about cars, you list a ton of things that scream you don't and didn't do any homework.

Get a walbro.
For the love of god, get an oil pressure gauge.
I'm going to assume you at min. have a boost gauge.
Fix the oil pan.
Did you do ANYTHING to this motor before taking it off the wood pallet and throwing it in? Compression test? New gaskets/internal inspection?
 
Discussion starter · #13 ·
i had no idea the oil pan would affect the car that bad... i drove a 76 el camino with a FUCKED UP oil pan for quite a while.... i dont have money to buy the walbro atm and im just trying to get the damn thing to sit there and idle at the right speed and not knock / clack its ass off. i have lots of research, what makes it seen i havent? this is my FIRST ever motor swap and my first time really messing with a turbo motor. i honestly dont have money for the walbro atm because im am BROKE from this swap and from xmas along with paying a shit ton of bills, thats why i asked if it was necissary. I asked JDM engine zone if the motor had been compression tested and they said yes. and i have had the valve cover off and the motor looks EXTREMELY clean. The motor hasnt ALWAYS made the noise. jsut recently while trying to figure out my idle problem did it start knocking while turning off then started doing it while it was idling. i have a boost gauge but its not installed yet and im going to fix the oil pan this friday. i was trying to jsut get the damn thing to fire up and idle correctly then was going to install the boost gauge, oil pressure guage and walbro pump.
 
#14 ·
If you didn't have everything needed, you should have waited.
You asked but didn't get any proof, and didn't do it yourself.
Taking the valve cover off is essentially looking in the window of a computer to see what shape it's in.
You said yourself even at first it knocked when you turned it off.
The oil pan is ridiculously small. Reading through any number of build threads would show you the lack of space and the clearance for the oil pickup

This is why I know you didn't do that much research. Reading 1 schmucks how-to is not doing research. Not checking out a motor that's either A: Sat in storage for years, B: been stuuuuuupidly abused before you got it, or C: Both, was nothing short of negligence.
 
#15 ·
and i have had the valve cover off and the motor looks EXTREMELY clean
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Just because the top of the motor is clean, that doesn't mean everything is good. The valvetrain will show very little evidence of what's going on beneath it.
but i was told the motor has less than 70k miles on it so it shouldnt be worn out already
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That's almost 113K KM. That motor was well abused in whatever car it came out of, especially if it was pulled out of S13 that lived its life as a drift car (which it probably did, considering that motor didn't just magically appear out of nowhere). You should have done some testing and possible rebuilding yourself before putting this motor in.
im just hoping it didnt spin a bearing or something
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Even if you "just" spun a bearing, there might be other issues. A spun bearing will allow the crank to walk and probably screw up other things in the process.
 
Discussion starter · #16 · (Edited by Moderator)
considering im out of a car and my car is my daily driver, i couldnt wait. it seems you are suggesting i buy the motor and tear it completely apart and rebuild it. im not going to do that to a motor that has less that 60k miles on it. how else would you suggest i tell the entire condition of the motor without breaking it totally down? i havent heard of anyone thats done an sr swap to pull their motor apart at all. ive read of people and shops doing it in under 7 hours. and how can i research the oil pan when i had no idea there were problems with it? i cant research EVERY little thing on this swap, especially when i dont know about them, like the pan. i havent read " 1 shmucks how to", ive read hours and hours of forum postings, guides, walkthroughs and im still at the place i am. plus you can read 5 threads and get 5 different answers, its hard to get a straight answer on alot of things... i wasnt looking at sr20 build threads because im not building an sr, im simply dropping it in and driving it. i have been looking at sr20 install threads. i was told by my father that the knocking when turned off was pre-ignition from being revved and held steady at 3k rpms then jsut being shut off (this was while i was trying to fix the idle)

ah well it was very unaware that i had to fully rebuild my whole motor before i could drop it in and drive it stock. ive heard no posts of people buying the motor and rebuilding it before they put it in. the motor has come from japan and 70k miles isnt shit. i see people at the drift events here with way over 100k miles on the sr and its stock and runs fine.
 
#17 ·
Wow, you obviously have no clue. If I were to estimate, off of reading builds, I would say roughly 70% of the people that do the swap do their own testing, and about 50% do a rebuild, while about 20% do a rebuild designed for additional boost. Have you asked every owner you've met with a SR if they rebuilt their motor? If they have a purpose built drift car, I can guarantee you they atleast did some testing. If you would have done the proper research, you would have seen that many people swap to a larger oil pan because the SR sometimes has oil pressure/pickup issues, especially when subjected to high RPM frequently.

Also, don't try to tell me that your motor was in good condition, you have no idea the condition of the motor. The company said they compression tested, but did they provide proof? Plus, you have no idea where that motor was sourced from. The motor came out of a car that was wrecked. Somebody didn't just drive down to the junkyard and donate their perfectly running car, for the sake of giving the motor to some drifter wannabe in the States. Chances are, that the donor car was crashed in a drift/race accident, just like 99% of the donor cars I've seen in the junkyards here in Okinawa. Are drift cars treated well? Hell no! You can't base the life of SR off of mileage, you have to base it off of KM's and 113,000 KM's is pretty high and and that's when many guys here start thinking about a stock rebuild, atleast. You have a pretty high mileage SR. Most motors I've seen used for swaps usually have about 50K miles.

Oh, also, I know that motor came from Japan, it's a SR afterall. ;) However, that does not make it perfect.
 
#18 ·
Customer's Obligations :
a) Customer must install new oil, oil filter, thermostat, spark plugs, coolant and tune up parts.
b) Customer must flush and refill radiator, change new water hoses, water pump, spark plugs, thermostat, oil filter, oil, oil pump, timing belt, timing belt tensioner, and all seals and gaskets that is necessary before installation.
c) Due to the variations and design on some models of Japanese version engines, customer is required to make necessary changes over on some parts such as change oil pan and oil pick up tube, dipstick, fly wheel, clutch assembly, distributor and smog device etc.
d) Customer is responsible to re-install all smog device's.
e) All belt-driving engines are required to be installed new timing belt and set on right timing before installation is done.
f) Check and adjust valve clearance and tune up.
g)
h) Customer is responsible to verify parts for fitness, proper size and application prior to installation. We assume no liability for parts incorrectly installed as the result of errors in ordering.
Click to expand...
Some light reading for you, off the website you ordered from.

Also WTF is this. Terms and conditions, but it's not even English. Live Translator says it's Danish...that would be a red flag to me.
Terms and Conditions


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#19 ·
Rick's right, as usual. Additionally, did you notice how every motor you see for sale from an importer is "low miles"? The only way to consider trusting the mileage is to get the entire clip and cluster with it. Even then, you're assuming someone didn't pick and match in between you and Japan.

I haven't done my SR swap. I still know to check the oil pan, inspect the motor, replace key parts (Timing kit, belts, gaskets).

I learned these things simply by reading this forum and the other big ones (NICO, Zilvia). There's an ungodly amount of information out there. You took a junkyard motor and expected it to be perfect. I'm baffled you didn't do things like timing and gaskets, but whatever, what's done is done.

Something else in the back of my mind, the car started and instantly went to 3k and held? That's insaaaaaaaanely harsh on a motor. No oil flowing yet, much less warmed oil. Doing that repeatedly, I could see where damage would ensue.
 
#20 ·
WakingDream said:
yea... it was idling high, at 3k rpms at first and then i guess the ecu relearned the idle and dropped it to under 1k and under 1k rpms the knock sounded quite loud.... im thinking it may not be getting any oil due to the pan being bent in pretty bad and im just hoping it didnt spin a bearing or something.... dont feel like having to get my crank turned
Click to expand...
whoa easy guys, lol.... stop cranking this thing... sorry but at this point you may as well start planning on new bearings. its not really expensive, just time consuming, as long as the crank isnt scored. And if it is Pm me and ill tell you the least expensive easiest way to get up and running.

If you keep running it though you will garantee a larger repair bill, and i assure you if the bent oil pan caused low oil pressure you DID spin a bearing .
 
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WakingDream
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