Hey guys I was wondering how much yall think I can get out of a NA KA24DE for about 1500? I might hold off on suspension and wheels for a while if I can make some decent power. Just wondering what yall think. Thanks guys later.
NA power.
wish i had a240
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seth said:
Price: $1199.99 USD
SR20DET Special Intake Manifold
Custom made to suit application.
Throttle flange can be made to fit a variety of sizes.
KA24 version also available.
SUPER FLOW BENCH TEST RESULTS:
Stock Intake Manifold: 180 CFM
Special Intake Manifold: 201 CFM
A gain of 10% using a stock ported head.
More flow expected with a ported head.
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Look. The problem isn't that the manifold can't flow air. The problem is that the runners are too long to achieve a full cylinder fill at high rpms (hell, not even that high of RPMs, it stops achieving a full fill as soon as the torque starts to drop off, around 4000).
Do whatever you want to the car to make it easier to intake air, and it still can't achieve a good fill at higher rpms until you replace the manifold. You aren't going to gain power simply because you're flowing better, you're going to achieve power because the manifold will shift your peak power much higher, probably near 7000. Since horsepower is a function of torque based on rpms, as you rev higher, you gain power. Shifting your peak from 5600 to 7000 even if you maintain the exact same torque will make you gain power. THAT is why the KA needs a new intake manifold.
Even KA turbos need one. Sure, you're forcing more air in, but you can't force in the optimal amount after 4000 rpms, which is why even KA-T graphs peak at 4000 (for torque).
Ever seen a KA dyno with different cams? It's lame. It's lame because the cams don't shift the powerband any higher. Sure, you gain on the top end because it can breathe better, but it still can't breathe worth crap on the top end. Cams aren't the problem. There are engines with mellower cam profiles (the b18b for example) which reach peak torque and thusly peak power later. Both are DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder, the b18b has much mellower cams, so what's the difference? The manifold.
That intake manifold is a shitty deal simply because it doesn't even have half the correct line inputs (maybe that's the SR version or whatever, but 1200 for a manifold is still absolutely ridiculous).
The reason KA's supposedly can't make power N/A is because nobody has tried. There isn't anything mystical about engines. The KA peaks low for a reason, but it seems nobody has bothered to examine that reason, even though it seems very obvious to me what the problem is.
Do whatever you want to the car to make it easier to intake air, and it still can't achieve a good fill at higher rpms until you replace the manifold. You aren't going to gain power simply because you're flowing better, you're going to achieve power because the manifold will shift your peak power much higher, probably near 7000. Since horsepower is a function of torque based on rpms, as you rev higher, you gain power. Shifting your peak from 5600 to 7000 even if you maintain the exact same torque will make you gain power. THAT is why the KA needs a new intake manifold.
Even KA turbos need one. Sure, you're forcing more air in, but you can't force in the optimal amount after 4000 rpms, which is why even KA-T graphs peak at 4000 (for torque).
Ever seen a KA dyno with different cams? It's lame. It's lame because the cams don't shift the powerband any higher. Sure, you gain on the top end because it can breathe better, but it still can't breathe worth crap on the top end. Cams aren't the problem. There are engines with mellower cam profiles (the b18b for example) which reach peak torque and thusly peak power later. Both are DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder, the b18b has much mellower cams, so what's the difference? The manifold.
That intake manifold is a shitty deal simply because it doesn't even have half the correct line inputs (maybe that's the SR version or whatever, but 1200 for a manifold is still absolutely ridiculous).
The reason KA's supposedly can't make power N/A is because nobody has tried. There isn't anything mystical about engines. The KA peaks low for a reason, but it seems nobody has bothered to examine that reason, even though it seems very obvious to me what the problem is.
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ch1873857 said:
It just annoys me to no end that people throw turbos on and change this and that and rebuild the engine etc. etc. yet they never change the intake manifold for some reason, and the dynos always peak really low, and so people claim you can't make N/A power without really even trying or having any idea about what the problem is.
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which manifold? One with shorter runners? Yes. Look at KA-T dyno graphs, the torque still peaks at 4000. Sure, you're pumping more in, but you're still fucked because you're only getting your maximum fill at 4000 rpms, it's all downhill from there.ch1873857 said:
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One that would make the torque peak at a point that makes the ideal shift point right at redline. As for how long the runners need to be... probably 5-7 inches.ch1873857 said:
Read my other thread for info on how we might go about getting one made.
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