drpping in a K20 from an rsx types, I never thoughtb I'd know a honda engine code, hmm...

 

i dont get da last post but i was talkin bout da USDM KA24DE engine....

 

Don't say 'da' it makes you sound gay. However, search! Because I know this has been asked, and theres a rather long thread going on now in regards to NA DOHC's. And why is your name SR20DETH if you don't have one?

 

drpping in a K20 from an rsx types, I never thoughtb I'd know a honda engine code, hmm...

lol, my thoughts exactly. maybe a b18c5? h22a? :gaylaugh

 

SR20DETH...just an internet name, i could use megaballlicker for all i care but anyway back to topic, i did a search on this but i couldnt seem to pin down the exact thread, is it possible that u remember the name of the thread? or part of it at least...thanks

 

problem is that the KA isn't the best when rev'd high. stroke is too long and the crank isn't balanced like a honda. you would have to destroke the KA or maybe use the crank from a KA20 in japan. or maybe get the crank balanced but i don't know how much that would help.

 

If you want high revving and fast revving then maybe you want an RB?

 

i had the rb in mind 1st but emissions up here are stricter than CARB...but if anything what would be the best rb possible to fit in a 93 240sx with minimal mods? and since we breached the engine swap topic, if it comes down to swapping which would be more practical? an rb or an sr20det swap? i understand the blacktop sr20det's produce about 200hp @ 7500 rpm (if my research was right) which is about in the same range im lookin for...so would it be easier to tune an sr20 vs a ka24 when it comes to high/fast revs?

 

ca18det, swith out the cams so you can rev high and still make the power.

 

ca18det, swith out the cams so you can rev high and still make the power.

i second this, almost 9000 rpm redline stock with power to boot i would say up to 7600. comes already turbo.

 

The best bet is to tell us what you want to do....more often than not 'an idea' is a lot different than what is needed to obtain it.

 

The ultimate high reving engine. The F20C.

 

i understand the blacktop sr20det's produce about 200hp @ 7500 rpm (if my research was right) which is about in the same range im lookin for...so would it be easier to tune an sr20 vs a ka24 when it comes to high/fast revs?

Actually it makes the most power at 6000 rpm, most car's make max power a bit before redline which is why I'm wondering why you're so infactuated with raising redline. And to your first post getting a ka24de to get decent power without forced induction is gonna cost MUCH MUCH more then just strapping a turbo on the Ka or getting an Sr. Revs don't really matter.

i second this, almost 9000 rpm redline stock with power to boot

I have no idea where people get this information. The CA does NOT redline at 9K stock. It redlines at about 7500 just like the SR. Why would a car which makes max power at 6400 rpm rev all the way up to 9000?

 

I have no idea where people get this information. The CA does NOT redline at 9K stock. It redlines at about 7500 just like the SR. Why would a car which makes max power at 6400 rpm rev all the way up to 9000?

Probably the same place this tidbit did. RPM's = Rev's = top speed (if there is enough power to do so)...power peak is another animal.

many cars that do multiple 3 figure speeds are not making peak power at the top, you could perhaps gear them that way, but that would often make a crappy street car.

 

Every single one of you are retarded.

First off all, if you wanted to, you can make a ka24 rev to 8k. You don't need to destroke it. The crank's rotational inertia is so heavy that its hard for the engine to overcome it to be able to make power in high revs. Lightening the drivetrain and the crank would intensly help. FOr ever pound lost off the crank, aproximately 2.7 hp is gained. Oh, and the rb26 has a MUCH larger stroke than the ka24, yet it rev's to 8k.

Rev's do not equal top speed. Rev's equal the ability to produce more horsepower through loss and concentration of torque. Horsepower is used to rate cars for a reason. It is the rate at which work is done. Why would you rev to 9k if your max power is at 6k?? thats just rediculous!!!! I'm sure the engine would be able to rev to 9, but that doesn't mean the engine doesn't have valve float, and the head flow is so inneficient at that engine speed so it won't make more power. The reason why aftermarket cam shafts are made is so that you can make more hp at the higher rpm's, beyond what your car was made for.

cars that are made to go 200+ mph would more then likely have crappy streetability in gearing......... because they aren't made for the street. Just because your car can rev high, doesn't mean it is better. civic si - 160 hp, nissan 240 - 155 hp. Who wins the racE? the 240 does. IT has a better powerband with more torque along the powerband, producing more hp per rpm than the civic (except peak).

Quit being ******* and stop reffering to honda engine's. There's a reason why this forum is called 240sx forums.

If yo uwant to rev high, rb is not your answer. If you want to make rediculous amounts of power, RB is your answer.

Chances are, if he doesn't want to spend money on a ka-t to make power, why the hell would he want to dump 2-5x times the amount than a ka-t would cost to swap in a sr20 or an RB???

IF you want to make an N/A ka24de, revving higher will definately be your first priority. Get aftermarket cam's, valve springs and retainers, ligghtweight flywheel and pully's, get a custom intake manifold with short runners (a must- this will allow you to make real power beyond 5k), 3 inch exhaust with hotshot headers. And get your crank knife edged. Allot of people buy aftermarket internal's because they are lighter and forged. This will also allow you to rev easier.

Redline is not determined by the limits of the crank, it is determined by the limits of the crank and the ability of power output combined. with all those mods listed above, you can rev to 10k for sure, but that won't necesarily you will make power in that area. Redline is determined by your power output, power bands, and the flow of your head. You may be able to raise your efficient redline by having your head ported and polished.


BarrigaS14, i don't know where you get your shit from, but everyone that i talk to that ACTUALLY know their shit about nissans' all assure me that the ka24 crank IS balanced from the factory. Another reason why people donit' have problems with running aftermarket crank pully's

 

Every single one of you are retarded.

First off all, if you wanted to, you can make a ka24 rev to 8k. You don't need to destroke it. The crank's rotational inertia is so heavy that its hard for the engine to overcome it to be able to make power in high revs. Lightening the drivetrain and the crank would intensly help. FOr ever pound lost off the crank, aproximately 2.7 hp is gained. Oh, and the rb26 has a MUCH larger stroke than the ka24, yet it rev's to 8k.

Rev's do not equal top speed. Rev's equal the ability to produce more horsepower through loss and concentration of torque. Horsepower is used to rate cars for a reason. It is the rate at which work is done. Why would you rev to 9k if your max power is at 6k?? thats just rediculous!!!! I'm sure the engine would be able to rev to 9, but that doesn't mean the engine doesn't have valve float, and the head flow is so inneficient at that engine speed so it won't make more power. The reason why aftermarket cam shafts are made is so that you can make more hp at the higher rpm's, beyond what your car was made for.

cars that are made to go 200+ mph would more then likely have crappy streetability in gearing......... because they aren't made for the street. Just because your car can rev high, doesn't mean it is better. civic si - 160 hp, nissan 240 - 155 hp. Who wins the racE? the 240 does. IT has a better powerband with more torque along the powerband, producing more hp per rpm than the civic (except peak).

Quit being ******* and stop reffering to honda engine's. There's a reason why this forum is called 240sx forums.

If yo uwant to rev high, rb is not your answer. If you want to make rediculous amounts of power, RB is your answer.

Chances are, if he doesn't want to spend money on a ka-t to make power, why the hell would he want to dump 2-5x times the amount than a ka-t would cost to swap in a sr20 or an RB???

IF you want to make an N/A ka24de, revving higher will definately be your first priority. Get aftermarket cam's, valve springs and retainers, ligghtweight flywheel and pully's, get a custom intake manifold with short runners (a must- this will allow you to make real power beyond 5k), 3 inch exhaust with hotshot headers. And get your crank knife edged. Allot of people buy aftermarket internal's because they are lighter and forged. This will also allow you to rev easier.

Redline is not determined by the limits of the crank, it is determined by the limits of the crank and the ability of power output combined. with all those mods listed above, you can rev to 10k for sure, but that won't necesarily you will make power in that area. Redline is determined by your power output, power bands, and the flow of your head. You may be able to raise your efficient redline by having your head ported and polished.


BarrigaS14, i don't know where you get your shit from, but everyone that i talk to that ACTUALLY know their shit about nissans' all assure me that the ka24 crank IS balanced from the factory. Another reason why people donit' have problems with running aftermarket crank pully's

Guy no offense but YOU are WRONG ON SO MANY LEVELS... first of all the RB has a much SMALLER stroke than the KA. The KA has 96mm stroke and the RB26 only has 73.7mm ---> 96 (KA) > 73.7 (RB26). Secondly you are partially right, revs do not equal top speed but redline is proportional to top speed. Study transmission gearing and how max vehicle speed is calculated for about 5 minutes. Secondly the redline limit is based on 3 major factors: stroke (determined by the crankshaft), rod length, and valve spring strength. The first two factors determine what the max piston speed will be (it must be low enough that the wrist pins and rod bearings doen't break), the last factor determines when the valves will float.

Again, no offense intended, but I think you need to study some basic physics and mechanics before you misinform other people with unfounded opinion instead of facts. :nono

And if you're going to take my corrections personally, please do some research into the facts first before you challenge anything I just said. I believe that if you do some research you will agree with evrything I just said.

PEACE

 

Every single one of you are retarded.

First off all, if you wanted to, you can make a ka24 rev to 8k. You don't need to destroke it. The crank's rotational inertia is so heavy that its hard for the engine to overcome it to be able to make power in high revs. Lightening the drivetrain and the crank would intensly help. FOr ever pound lost off the crank, aproximately 2.7 hp is gained. Oh, and the rb26 has a MUCH larger stroke than the ka24, yet it rev's to 8k.

Rev's do not equal top speed. Rev's equal the ability to produce more horsepower through loss and concentration of torque. Horsepower is used to rate cars for a reason. It is the rate at which work is done. Why would you rev to 9k if your max power is at 6k?? thats just rediculous!!!! I'm sure the engine would be able to rev to 9, but that doesn't mean the engine doesn't have valve float, and the head flow is so inneficient at that engine speed so it won't make more power. The reason why aftermarket cam shafts are made is so that you can make more hp at the higher rpm's, beyond what your car was made for.

cars that are made to go 200+ mph would more then likely have crappy streetability in gearing......... because they aren't made for the street. Just because your car can rev high, doesn't mean it is better. civic si - 160 hp, nissan 240 - 155 hp. Who wins the racE? the 240 does. IT has a better powerband with more torque along the powerband, producing more hp per rpm than the civic (except peak).

Quit being ******* and stop reffering to honda engine's. There's a reason why this forum is called 240sx forums.

If yo uwant to rev high, rb is not your answer. If you want to make rediculous amounts of power, RB is your answer.

Chances are, if he doesn't want to spend money on a ka-t to make power, why the hell would he want to dump 2-5x times the amount than a ka-t would cost to swap in a sr20 or an RB???

IF you want to make an N/A ka24de, revving higher will definately be your first priority. Get aftermarket cam's, valve springs and retainers, ligghtweight flywheel and pully's, get a custom intake manifold with short runners (a must- this will allow you to make real power beyond 5k), 3 inch exhaust with hotshot headers. And get your crank knife edged. Allot of people buy aftermarket internal's because they are lighter and forged. This will also allow you to rev easier.

Redline is not determined by the limits of the crank, it is determined by the limits of the crank and the ability of power output combined. with all those mods listed above, you can rev to 10k for sure, but that won't necesarily you will make power in that area. Redline is determined by your power output, power bands, and the flow of your head. You may be able to raise your efficient redline by having your head ported and polished.


BarrigaS14, i don't know where you get your shit from, but everyone that i talk to that ACTUALLY know their shit about nissans' all assure me that the ka24 crank IS balanced from the factory. Another reason why people donit' have problems with running aftermarket crank pully's

hey buddy reading comprehension. let me reiterate what i said...

"the crank isn't balanced like a honda"

now where did i say that the engine is NOT balanced? hmmmm...lets take a couple minutes to re-read and stop thinking we know it all. now lets get back to the point.

the KA is not balanced like a Honda engine. personally the KA is a rough engine and i would be really afraid of taking it to really high levels of reving unless it is a racing engine. now funny thing is that the aftermarket crank pulley's haven't been around for a long time and not many people run them because in all reality...they do very little. (dyno's love to prove shit like this).

and i highly doubt that your...ahhh...ASSumptions of running a KA to 10K is very accurate. many people in Az have done alot of work with NA KA's both E and DE verisons and what they have found is.......well not much.

i guess it is good to actually try to talk like you have worked on engines and shit like that. because we all know that when you say things in formulas and funny educated things it makes what you say is the truth. we see soooooooo many KA's running in the 10k range and soooo many of the people you have talked to blah blah blah.

but in reality...the only thing that i and many others care about is dyno numbers and track time. and i doubt....highly doubt you have either.

 

I have no idea where people get this information. The CA does NOT redline at 9K stock. It redlines at about 7500 just like the SR. Why would a car which makes max power at 6400 rpm rev all the way up to 9000?

i just hear a lot about this, as i too doubt that it redlines at 9000. but im sure that wut most ppl mean that it can rev to 9k without any headwork. but anyways, you would need a lotta money to make power to use around the 9k range, but it would be a nice and a fun lil beast in the end.

 

Guy no offense but YOU are WRONG ON SO MANY LEVELS...

confirmed.

By the way you may want to enlighten yourself with piston speed.

 

confirmed.

By the way you may want to enlighten yourself with piston speed.

Why what did I say wrong? It's determined by the stroke and the rod length. I didn't get too detailed about that so I can't see where I went wrong.

 

Redline is not determined by the limits of the crank, it is determined by the limits of the crank and the ability of power output combined. with all those mods listed above, you can rev to 10k for sure, but that won't necesarily you will make power in that area. Redline is determined by your power output, power bands, and the flow of your head. You may be able to raise your efficient redline by having your head ported and polished

10k? Did you honestly just claim that a KA can be made to rev to 10k?

You are full of shit, and here's why: With a 96mm stroke, at 10,000 rpms, your average piston speed is 96 ft/s, over double what's considered a reliable piston speed (about 42 ft/s). Due to the forces involved, your bearings would sieze, your crankshaft would snap, and you'd punch at least 4 holes in various parts of you engine.

Also, top speed is very much influenced by engine RPM. If you have a redline of 5k, you're going to need a far wider gearing to reach 200mph than something that revs to 9k.

Pretty much everything you said was wrong. Also, there's a difference between effectively running at an RPM, and being able to attain an RPM. Replacing the intake manifold isn't going to magically let you rev higher, it's only going to improve your torque AT higher rpms.

The maximum speed for a KA is about 8200 rpms when all's said and done, considering that's the redline on the NISMO offroad KA24DE. If you want something you can drive around daily, you're probably looking at a limit of 7500.

 

... i know i'll sound like a smart ass... but get a bike if you want to attributes

 

hey buddy reading comprehension. let me reiterate what i said...

"the crank isn't balanced like a honda"

now where did i say that the engine is NOT balanced? hmmmm...lets take a couple minutes to re-read and stop thinking we know it all. now lets get back to the point.

the KA is not balanced like a Honda engine. personally the KA is a rough engine and i would be really afraid of taking it to really high levels of reving unless it is a racing engine. now funny thing is that the aftermarket crank pulley's haven't been around for a long time and not many people run them because in all reality...they do very little. (dyno's love to prove shit like this).

So if theres some median between a balanced crank and a non-balanced crank, please let me know. If you have ever dissasembled a crank pully on a ka you would notice there are no harmonic balancers. FRom this, anyone can conclude that the crank IS blanced.

http://importtuner.com/tech/0210it_powerpages/
From the dyno sheets provided, Pully's showed a more significant gain than the exhaust and cold air intake.

You are all right though, i don't know what i was thinking when i said the ka stroke was smaller than the RB. Sorry for my misinformation. I was also just trying to expand on what alkemyst said about redline, and i was obviously exaggerating about ka speed, but i got my information mixed up and thought that it could rev higher than you guys were saying.
And again, sorry, Lol.

 

Why what did I say wrong? It's determined by the stroke and the rod length. I didn't get too detailed about that so I can't see where I went wrong.

my confirm was in agreement to your comment on the previous poster.

You knew where you were coming from ...

 

So if theres some median between a balanced crank and a non-balanced crank, please let me know. If you have ever dissasembled a crank pully on a ka you would notice there are no harmonic balancers. FRom this, anyone can conclude that the crank IS blanced.

http://importtuner.com/tech/0210it_powerpages/
From the dyno sheets provided, Pully's showed a more significant gain than the exhaust and cold air intake.

You are all right though, i don't know what i was thinking when i said the ka stroke was smaller than the RB. Sorry for my misinformation. I was also just trying to expand on what alkemyst said about redline, and i was obviously exaggerating about ka speed, but i got my information mixed up and thought that it could rev higher than you guys were saying.
And again, sorry, Lol.

yes and yes. if you look at a Honda engine and a KA then you will notice much more balancing in the crank. but you haven't so go back to bed and read what you find on the internet. we have all proven that you read what you see and then try to claim it as first hand experiance. and there is a median. some engines...older ones. used less balancing than they do now...why cuz of technology changes that come around. it is just evolution. and it does have an harmonic balancer. all engine does unless it is a rotary...mmmm...well not sure about a rotary but assuming that they are pretty much an engine that goes round and round rather than having to stop violently to get it's next cycle would seem like it would be alot more balanced...ehhh...not a rotary expert.